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GOLDSEA |
ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
The White Stuff: Whiting Wongs & Wonging Whites
hey're our neighbors, buddies, allies, enemies, clients, bosses, employees, lovers and spouses. Many of us have more daily contact with Whites than with other Asians. Consequently, we often feel we know them better than they can ever know us. Maybe that's at the heart of our frustration as Asian Americans. They are as ubiquitous and pervasive as the air we breath while to them it seems we are eternal curiosities, outsiders, exotics.
Bridging the gap?
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And so we sometimes find ourselves lashing out with nasty generalizations about the people we blame for all that seems wrong with American society and, more specifically, our place in it. They are ignorant, shallow, boorish, smelly, sneaky, treacherous, malicious, dumb, weird -- in short, all the labels we feel have been so unfairly slapped on us.
But even as we hurl such epithets we cannot forget the countless acts of kindness, warmth, generosity, friendship, passion and love that we have enjoyed from these very same people. As our anger and frustration subside, we recognize that our fates are inextricably intertwined, not merely in sharing a world, a nation, a society, an economy, a culture -- but often in sharing even our most intimate lives. One in five of today's Asian American marriages are to Whites. And contrary to the imbalance of the past, the ratio of new AM/WF marriages to new AF/WM marriages is steadily approaching unity.
So we naturally have a strong interest in decoding the other side of the equation. Understanding is a two-way street. Fortunately, there are Whites who have enough interest in us as individuals to share their perspectives on us and on their interactions with us. This page is for those who -- as corny as it may sound -- have chosen to serve as bridges.
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Discussions posted during the past year remain available for browsing.
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
(Updated
Wednesday, Jan 22, 2025, 06:38:55 AM)
maxdacat,
'Popiah' is definitely not a Cantonese or Mandarin word. It sounds either like Tiew-jiew or Hokkien or maybe some other dialect. I haven't eaten this particular dish (that i am referring to) at any Hong Kong restaurant. They are not really spring rolls; They're much bigger and not fried. You have to roll them up yourself at the table, putting as much yummy stuff as you can inside. If you get too greedy, the whole thing falls apart on your plate or on your lap.
krasavitsa
Thursday, June 13, 2002 at 07:22:48 (PDT)
k,
leaving this saturday! the food is really very dull, always the same starters, steak & fish....hardly ever spicy.
i recently worked for 3 weeks in thailand and we ate out with the people at the office everyday at a different restaurant.
i think the main difference is in europe you can get good food some of the time but in asia you will find good food everywhere - from a roadside diner at 2 in the morning to an airport or hotel restaurant.
maxdacat
Thursday, June 13, 2002 at 02:39:39 (PDT)
kimchi
I take back what i said about the boyfriend. I just spoke to him and it turns out he was VERY upset about the Japanese beating the Russians in soccer! Ay yi yi. And he said that in Russia some Japanese people got beaten up. We nearly had an argument because i'm very sensitive about ethnic violence, and he can get very defensive about Russia (I just found out).
Sometimes i'm envious about people who have a country to be patriotic to, a culture that they completely identify with. I'm patriotic to Australia, but it seems quite impossible when, in mainstream discourse, patriotism equals defending White Australia against "Asianisation". How the hell am I meant to be patriotic when my own country is trying to defend itself against me? Do Asians in the US feel the same way?
Sometimes i think maybe migration gives rise to too many problems, and right from the beginning everybody should have just stayed in the tribe, village or town where they were born. Then people wouldn't have cultural identity crises, everybody would be absolutely sure of their own world views. Of course, this would only work if peoples didn't conquer or colonise each other.
Whenever i hear patriotism coming from all sides, i feel as if i might as well be living in the ocean. I'm an outsider to my family because i'm not Chinese, an outsider to my country of citizenship AND my country of birth because I am Chinese, and an outsider to my boyfriend because i'm not Russian.
I want to be... under the sea... in an octopuses garden, in the shade...
krasavitsa
Wednesday, June 12, 2002 at 22:19:49 (PDT)
Question,
Thanks for teaching me the joke and telling me about your boyfriend's family. You told me that your boyfriend's parents moved from mainland China to Hong Kong, so I am guessing they speak Cantonese. But I am not sure because a lot of mandarin Chinese also moved to Hong Kong to escape communism. The reason why I mentioned what kind of Chinese dialet they might speak is that I think it is important in understanding their culture. Here in the U.S. (and in Canada, too) there are two main sub-cultures in the Chinese American community: Mandarin and Cantonese. Cantonese (especially the ones from Hong Kong) tend to keep traditions very strongly such as worshipping Chinese gods, believing in lucky numbers like 8 and 9, checking with the lunar calendar for lucky dates to get married, etc. By contrast, Mandarin people don't carry out these practices, or at least not as much. It is also my experience that Cantonese people tend to resent interracial relationships more because they worry that Caucasians don't take relationships seriously. By contrast, Mandarin people tend to be more receptive about interracial relationships. They think Caucasians are averagely better-looking because of paler skin complexion, deep eye sockets, and tall noses. They also think interracial kids are very cute. I went to northern China last summer with my BF. My BF is just average looking, but people thought he was just as handsome as a movie star. Some even asked us when we would get married and have a cute baby. You got the impression that a lot of people resent interracial relationships maybe because Cantonese Americans make up most of the Chinese American population here in the US. Most Chinese diasporas in Southeast Asia like Thailand, Malaysia, Singapore, etc. are also Cantonese.
So, if your BF comes from a Cantonese background, I can see why he doesn't relate to some of the beliefs. My parents are both Cantonese, but I was born in a Mandarin region. I don't agree with some of the Cantonese beliefs, either. Once I got really annoyed at my ex-roommate when she insisted on chaning the phone number just because it sounded "unlucky".
You mentioned that your BF doesn't want to talk about Confusianism. Well I think most guys don't want to talk about philosophy. Besides, he might not know much about Confusianism and he might feel uncomfortable that people expect him to know. Not all Chinese can explain what Confusianism is, maybe because it is so blended into the culture that even schools don't teach it explicitly as confusionism anymore. I know that in mainland China, it is blamed for setting women's inferior social status in history. Other aspects of confusianism are good such as the emphasis of education and respect for elderlies. In terms of politics, confusianism is kind of like Pluto's "Republic". It believes that a nation should be led by a wise person and that person should be responsible for the welfare of his people.
Red Red Seashell
redshell00@yahoo.com
Wednesday, June 12, 2002 at 11:30:14 (PDT)
kimchi,
I don't think he could care less about soccer, and anyway compared to most Russians he's not ardently nationalistic. He'd rather watch Spongebob than the World Cup :)) By the way, Spongebob is sooo cool!!! I watched it in NY but tragically we don't have it here in Oz. I might have to start a petition.
maxdacat,
How're you doing? How come Portugal is boring? Don't they have great spicy foods? I saw the Portugese soccer team, they look scary, man! Do they have Spongebob over there?
krasavitsa
Wednesday, June 12, 2002 at 01:15:13 (PDT)
Red Red Seashell,
thanks for your response! My boyfriend is 1st generation. His Mom and Dad were born on the mainland, and he was born in Hong Kong. They moved here when he was 3. He considers himself kind of "Americanized". He speaks Chinese, but doesn't write it. He respects his culture, and is proud of who he is, but I think he's kind of caught in the middle- he doesn't relate perfectly to all of the Chinese beliefs, customs, etc, but he doesn't relate perfectly to whites that have lived here for generations either. It must be hard.
I've been reading things on goldsea for a while in an effort to learn more, and I have been reading also.
I can understand why you feel hurt when they say "your country", as if you weren't American. I'm sorry for that. Maybe make a joke about it, to let them know, like "Isn't it interesting that Europeans call our country "the states"?" I'm glad to hear you say that not all AA look down on interracial relationships, sometimes I get the feeling on goldsea that a lot do. And I'm glad your parents are accepting of your relationship.
Krasavitsa,
thanks for your post too, I don't mind your ramblings. I think I am going to read more about Confucian thinking. I've tried to ask my b/f in the past but honestly he seems reluctant to talk about it, so I don't push it. Also I am interested in hearing many different viewpoints from all types of people.
question
Tuesday, June 11, 2002 at 11:33:43 (PDT)
K,
FYI.....the Thai word for springroll is also "popiah".....not sure about its derviation whether from cantonese or tiew jiew (who made up most of thailand's chinese diaspora)....i know this from working at a thai restaurant in sydney while studying.
maxdacat
Tuesday, June 11, 2002 at 09:36:42 (PDT)
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